Braided Brake Lines


CVSensei

CVSensei

New member
After reading up on them a little bit it seems like a worthy investment, anyone have any recommendations? I've heard HEL are good and found them selling some on ebay.. They have two versions though.

Any info would be great!
 
Ralph

Ralph

New member
Dont have a recommendation as to make but get fully stainless ones on some the unions and crimps
were the line meets the union are not stainless and soon show corrosion.
 
N

nobull

New member
Get new pads first - makes 99% difference to 1% of braided lines, assuming we are talking road use where overheating isn't an issue. In my humble opinion its a waste of money on a road bike, unless you have to change them anyway or for aesthetic reasons.
 
CVSensei

CVSensei

New member
Noggie said:
I find the nose dive a bigger issue than the brakes........
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Got a full Ohlins kit being fitted in a week so that will no longer be an issue :)

Interesting how some people swear by them and others are not bothered at all. I admit I had never even heard of them until recently but they sound like a good purchase for a long term machine.

And I have no intention of selling any time soon!
 
D

Deleted member 20

Guest
nobull said:
Get new pads first - makes 99% difference to 1% of braided lines, assuming we are talking road use where overheating isn't an issue. In my humble opinion its a waste of money on a road bike, unless you have to change them anyway or for aesthetic reasons.
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Fully agree, new lines are 90% bling, new pads are 100% performance.
CVSensei, I assume you have replaced your pads prior to looking at new lines.

Note that Brembo offers 6 different front compounds (4 racing and 2 road) and at least 2 different rear compunds. Avoid the "Road Carbon Ceramic" compound since it's pretty much offers the same lame performance as stock pads.

I suggest new Brembo pads as per below. I use them myself and they are in my opinion ideal for all road applications as well as moderate track day usage. I don't have 1st hand experience using track compound pads.

Brake Pads Brembo 07YA23SA sintered street (1 couple for 1 disk) - Specific for Yamaha MT-07

Brake Pads Brembo 07HO36SP rear sintered street (1 couple for 1 disk): please note Hornet 600 07- and Transalp 700 only ABS models - Specific for Yamaha MT-07
 
CVSensei

CVSensei

New member
No I haven't replaced them, haven't felt the need for better braking performance, my OEM pads and ABS have kept me safe.

But now that you've mentioned it AND provided links I have to buy them :rolleyes: Thanks for that!

How much of a difference do they make in the real world?
 
D

Deleted member 20

Guest
CVSensei said:
How much of a difference do they make in the real world?
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The thing with pads is that they do make a huge difference in the real world.
All aspects of braking is improved using Brembo SP+SA compound pads. Lot more bite, greater feel &modulation, fade resistance, they seem to hold up well with little wear on pad and stock rotors. I've done 10000 km with mine, still looks like new.

Replacing lines, specially on ABS bikes with so many lines all over the bike is pretty expensive, time consuming and fiddly. If you want to replace ALL lines on the bike.
 
CVSensei

CVSensei

New member
Right well this is definitely on the agenda then. Are they straightforward to fit?

Never changed pads before and very cautious with things as critical as them. Does it involve changing the fluid as well?
 
Ralph

Ralph

New member
You wont need to change the fluid and they are easy to change but
you have to make sure you don't let the pistons pop out of the callipers,
if you have not done it before I would recommend you get someone that as
done it before to help and show you how it's done as if anything on the bike
is going to fail you don't want it to be the brakes. If you do the lines you are
then going to loose fluid and will have to bleed the system if it's ABS that
makes things worse if you get air in the ABS pump it's a right pain to shift.
 
D

Deleted member 20

Guest
CVSensei said:
Does it involve changing the fluid as well?
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You should replace fluid every 2 years since the fluid will attract moist, thus lowering the boiling temp.
When you replace fluid I suggest using DOT5.1 which withstand higher temps (boiling point) than DOT4 and DOT3.
Standard specify temps >260°C, >230°C and >205°C respectively.

Racing fluids are typically DOT4, exceeding both DOT4 and DOT5.1 with boiling points well above 300°C, but they doesn't meet the low temp viscosity of DOT5.1, that's why they're only DOT4 rated.

For road usage DOT5.1 is the way to go, for racing and extreme temps use DOT4 racing fluid.

Brand or price of fluid is irrelevant, trust the DOT5.1 rating and shop for the cheapest bottle. The stuff I use cost €4.90 for 250 ml which is more than enough for one bike.

Replacing fluid doesn't require any special tools other than a clear plastic hose on the calipers bleeder nut.
Open the fluid reservoir and the bleeder nut, pump the lever slowly (to avoid splatter) until reservoir is almost empty.
Wipe lid and inside of reservoir with a clean cloth if it's dirty and messy.
Fill up reservoir, pump again, fill upp, pump until you have flushed/filled the system with new fluid.
Hopefully you can see the differens in colour of the fluid coming though your transparent hose and into your waste bottle.
Close the bleeder nut and remove the hose. Top up fluid to the mark in reservoir. Close it.

Since front calipers are in line (master cylinder -> caliper 1 -> caliper 2) bleed caliper 1 first, then close it and finish off by bleeding the line between caliper 1 and 2 as well as caliper 2.

IMPORTANT! Never use DOT5 fluid since it's a completely different product. Can not be mixed with DOT3, DOT4 and DOT5.1 fluids!
 
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R

rappetor

New member
Saw a video about how to change the pads recently, let me have a look for you :)

Found it!:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CI4SfSi_RqE

The order in the repair manual is a bit different (there the clip and pins are removed with the caliper still on the bike). And in the repair manual the bleed screw is opened when the pistons are pushed back (I guess this also depends on the fluid level in the reservoir and how much your current pads are worn). If it's possible without bleeding the brakes that would be much more easy ofcourse..
 
N

Noggie

New member
CVSensei said:
Got a full Ohlins kit being fitted in a week so that will no longer be an issue :)

Interesting how some people swear by them and others are not bothered at all. I admit I had never even heard of them until recently but they sound like a good purchase for a long term machine.

And I have no intention of selling any time soon!
Click to expand...
I did a lot of car track driving in my younger days.
Braided brake lines will give better feel, but not much on the performance.
Pads will improve on the braking performance.
I suspect the brake lines will improve on the abs activation point though.

Ohlins is high quality stuff, and I am considering the same update during the winter.
They have been heavily into car racing for decades, and is a brand I know and would put my trust in for sure.
Let me know how that changes the bike.
 
CVSensei

CVSensei

New member
I've yet to hear someone say the upgrade didn't completely transform the bike so I think it's a safe bet.

I went for the package for 480 GBP which seems like an absolute bargain but yes, I will report back!
 
D

Deleted member 20

Guest
When swapping rear shock to Ohlins, make sure the spring is right for your weight. If the spring is too hard your comfort and traction will suffer. My rule is to use as soft of a spring as I can and add more damping, rather than the other way around. Be sure to measure your sag when replacing shock and selecting spring rate.

Yamaha MT07 stock shock spring rate is 107,8 N/mm
Ohlins for MT07 shock standard spring #01092-41 has a spring rate of 115 N/mm
(my limited experience is telling me Ohlins springs are harder than Yamahas, given same N/mm on the label ;-)

Alternative Ohlins springs are:
#01092-31 = 95 N/mm
#01092-34 = 100 N/mm
#01092-44 = 120 N/mm
#01092-49 = 130 N/mm
 
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N

Noggie

New member
and30ers said:
When swapping rear shock to Ohlins, make sure the spring is right for your weight. If the spring is too hard your comfort and traction will suffer. My rule is to use as soft of a spring as I can and add more damping, rather than the other way around. Be sure to measure your sag when replacing shock and selecting spring rate.

Yamaha MT07 stock shock spring rate is 107,8 N/mm
Ohlins for MT07 shock standard spring #01092-41 has a spring rate of 115 N/mm
(my limited experience is telling me Ohlins springs are harder than Yamahas, given same N/mm on the label ;-)

Alternative Ohlins springs are:
#01092-31 = 95 N/mm
#01092-34 = 100 N/mm
#01092-44 = 120 N/mm
#01092-49 = 130 N/mm
Click to expand...
Good advise, however I am a good 100kg with my gear on, and have the stock spring preload set to 8, the rear is ok for normal rides, but once I start pushing a little in corners it feels wage, and not planted. Also I sometimes feel like its not stable at motorway speeds it kind of feels like the rear is moving around a bit, but when I gently change direction I can feel its fine, hard to explain, but it's not good for confidence.
The front forks are very soft and the front end dive is really bad, I admit I have adapted my braking technique so it's not as bad as it was when I first started out.
 
Scim77

Scim77

Member
Brake Lines and Ohlins

You have already received some wise advice from other contributors and I agree with the sentiments expressed. Better brake pads will make a much bigger improvement than braided hoses. Having said that, there will be an improvement in consistency and progressiveness when good braided hoses are fitted. They eliminate sponginess and improve confidence, due to their predictability. The ABS will probably respond more consistently, too.

On my much older Norton Commando and MotoGuzzi bikes, braided hoses made a massive difference, improving 'feel' and power enormously. I was replacing very old standard hoses with braided, so the improvement was huge. On your relatively young MT-07 the improvement will be less dramatic, but worthwhile nonetheless. I used EARLS hoses (Silverstone) on these bikes. They made hoses to my exact dimensions and specifications and there were excellent quality and fitted perfectly. Earls are very knowledgeable and helpful but it is far easier to phone them rather than wade through the endless options on their website.

Earl's Performance Products UK - Performance Motorbike Stainless Braided Brakeline Kits

On my MT-07 I have HEL braided lines, which look and perform superbly (Thanks Gary)

Regarding Ohlins suspension, we used them 20 years ago when my son was heavily into MotoCrossing and they were peerless.
 
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